[00:00:00] Rosalyn: Welcome to the revenue engine podcast. I'm your host, Rosalyn Santa Elena. And I am thrilled to bring you the most inspirational stories from revenue, generators, innovators, and disruptors revenue leaders in sales, in marketing. And of course in operations. Together, we will unpack everything that optimizes and powers that the revenue engine are.

You ready? Let's get to it. After reading an interview with Rosie Rocha, the chief customer officer at Hoppin. I immediately knew that I wanted her as a guest on the revenue engine podcast. Rosie joined Hoppin during a period of explosive growth when the pandemic hit and meetings, events, networking, and pretty much all social moved online and virtual.

But aside from being a leader at a high growth company, Rosie has an amazing backstory from her time working with the new England Patriots, her time at both Harvard and at Stanford and her time at a startup, which led to an incredible career at Salesforce, from a customer success manager to the senior VP of customer experience.

Rosie shares some of the traits that helped her to help her customers to be more successful. She mentions running toward the challenges, focusing on the customer challenges and the customer experience, and always finding the shiny and bright. That thing that's really important to keep you motivated and stay engaged.

She also talks about prioritizing your customers and helping them be successful. So take a listen to this episode with Rosie Roca, you won't be disappointed and you will learn so much from this customer success powerhouse.

Absolutely thrilled to be here today with Rosie Roca that chief customer officer at hop in hop in is the virtual venue for live online events. With the objective of giving organizations, the ability to recreate the in-person event. Experience virtual. And all in one place with the challenges of 2020 Hoppin has experienced explosive growth with meetings, events, networking, and pretty much all social moving online and virtual.

So welcome Rosie. And thank you so much for joining me. So excited 

[00:02:31] Rosie: to be here. Thank you for having me. 

[00:02:33] Rosalyn: Yeah, thank you. So, you know, as I've shared with you before, when, you know, I was thinking about the revenue engine podcast, I really wanted to not only feed you sure. Leaders who have had experience in driving revenue and driving revenue growth, but leaders who are making a difference elsewhere.

Right. And they have an interesting story to share that can help others. So I'm super, super excited to share your story and just learn more about your journey. Oh, 

[00:02:56] Rosie: I'm very grateful for the opportunity and, uh, excited to learn more about you also, as we go through this conversation. 

[00:03:03] Rosalyn: Thank you so much. So let's start out.

I mean, you've had just an incredible career, right. That led you to joining Hoppin in 2020. So before we talk about some of your journey and customer success, I'd love to hear more about how it sort of all started with your first job. And what I heard was that it was in marketing research. So maybe, can you take us back to that conference that you attended?

Sports and how it led to your first role? Yeah, 

[00:03:28] Rosie: absolutely. Lee. And I'll say it, it all comes down to a dream. I think in many ways that my family had for me when I was very young, um, my grandparents and my parents really thought that I would make a good attorney or a good lawyer. I don't know why I must have been an argumentative child.

Um, and you know, with that idea, I went to college and try to prepare for what that journey would look like eventually. And very quickly, well, maybe not so quickly, but my, my senior year in college, I had this realization that law school was probably not going to be a good fit for me. And I'm very grateful for that, for that moment, because it came certainly before going through the process of applying to law school.

But what that meant is that right? I had to now, and in this final moment of my university career, figure out my next steps, uh, and really rethink what my professional journey was going to look like. And the best way for me to think through that was to attend events that were happening at my university at the time.

And so I bought, I found a bunch of conferences that I could go to, to go deeper into areas of interest that I had. And one of them was sports and entertainment. Uh, and that's where I met the Jessica Gelman, who was a director of operations at the time for Gillette stadium. And the new England Patriots and found her, she basically did something like this.

You shared her career, um, to share some of the interesting projects that she was working on and really captured my interest and got very lucky because we ended up sitting right next to each other, uh, for lunch and struck up a conversation. And, you know, I recall that as being one of those big inflection moments in my life, uh, where I found this kindred spirit in many ways, um, with a lot of excitement and energy about doing something super interesting.

And, um, she was really thinking about how to. Drive new ideas and new projects for the organization. Um, and one of the key inputs into that was the customer experience and what our customers, uh, at the time, you know, whether they're season ticket holders or, um, event customers thought about that experience and, and, and really finding opportunities to improve on it.

That's how I landed at market research. Um, and you know, we were part of the broader marketing organization for the Kraft sports group, which is the owning entity of the new England Patriots and Gillette stadium, um, and stayed there for four years. And every project, every conversation was something new and interesting, and I'm super grateful because in many ways it was a startup.

Customer success journey. Um, and really is the place where I, I developed a deep appreciation for going back to the user, going back to the customer to understand. That the impact of the business, um, and that it's having on their lives and how we can make that better. And that's been the silver thread, I think, throughout my entire career.

Wow. 

[00:06:31] Rosalyn: That's amazing. So you spent four years there. Um, and then, so you sort of, you've mentioned that it sort of, that's kind of how you're pivoted into sort of this customer success and really started your journey. And I know that you. You know, at Salesforce, right. You really rose through the ranks. Right.

I know you started as a customer success manager and then the senior manager, director, senior director kind of climbing all the way up to like a senior VP, um, role of customer experience, right. During your tenure there. So can you talk a little bit about sort of how you ended up sort of going from, you know, new England Patriots to sales force and sort of that rise, um, through sales?

[00:07:06] Rosie: Absolutely. I mean, I I'll tell you. Inspired by a different, uh, different threat, which, uh, while we were, um, at the new England Patriots and part of this team that was thinking differently, one of our key. Proposals, uh, was around technology. And how do we leverage technology to make that experience more cohesive and to better understand our customers?

And so the, the really that transition between sports and SAS was that was that thought of what, you know, what are the things that technology can do to help us all improve, um, how we are creating connections and, and really investing in our community. And so, um, I actually left the pitchers to go to business school and it was in business school that, um, I started learning a little bit more about Silicon valley and, uh, what it meant to go to a technology company.

And, um, given my background in market research and lack of fear, generally speaking about dialing up anyone to ask any questions. You know, I walked around with this idea for a while that I sh that I wanted to be in sales, um, and try to be at that moment of connection between the product and value that, uh, happens in that conversation.

Um, and, uh, you know, met several leaders, uh, as I was looking for my next opportunity. And through those conversations really came to understand, yeah. The world of customer success. And how do you move beyond that one moment that I was thinking of as being really pivotal of the sales process and really deliver on the ROI, the ROI, excuse me, and the value of that technology.

And so, um, Had a great mentor advise me to really consider customer success because of all the different elements that he should years with this concept of market research of going back to your users and really understanding them and driving those initiatives to make their experience better. Um, and that's how I really started my journey.

 You know, at Salesforce, I had an incredible opportunity to learn from world-class leaders that really prioritize customer success and what it meant.

And ultimately they were the ones that invented that term and really invested in it and set a standard for the whole SAS industry on how to think about that customer relationship. And so I was very lucky. I, I was presented with opportunities and projects that help to advance what customer success meant, uh, both for the product and company that I came from as part of the acquisition, but for other products that shared similar characteristics and users, um, that where we were trying to think differently about how to go to market.

Um, and so, yeah, it was an incredible journey and, and very, very much informative of how I think about the world today and how I think about technology and how I think about bringing the human. Is human interaction back into a lot of the relationships that we have with vendors and customers on both sides.

Yeah, 

[00:09:59] Rosalyn: that sounds like a very natural fit for you, sort of in your interest, in what you're really, you know, where you're really passionate about since it seems like it was just sort of a very natural play to kind of fall into the customer success area. Um, what are some of the, you know, if you look back at sort of that climb, like, what are some of the characteristics or sort of traits that you think have really helped you be successful in this, in this 

[00:10:21] Rosie: space?

I would say. Customer success is one of the most rewarding and also challenging roles, um, out there. And, um, the reason for that is because you almost sit at the center, well, the different interactions and touch points that that customer has with your company or with the tour, with the technologies that you're offering.

And so you almost have to be a master of all trades and, and really, um, keep track of all the different conversations that are happening. And so I think for me within that context, one of the key things that that experience brought me for was, uh, prepare me for was this affinity to gravitate, to.

Challenging problems again, that lack of fear of really helping, um, any customer and addressing any. So I would say from a criteria, six perspective, um, my recommendation or the things that I think have made me successful and I've seen in other leaders have been running toward the challenges and really finding hard problems.

Can help you to make a better connection between what you're, the products and the tools that you're offering and the value that you bring into your customers. So how do you, how do you make that? Um, even more cohesive? The second one would be focusing on the customer challenges and the customer experience at all.

At the end of the day, we are all here because we're creating incredible experiences that were incredible new products for those customers. So there, um, you know, that old adage is absolutely true. The customer is king or queen. Um, and so we want to make sure that they're at the center of everything, um, finding that shiny.

Yeah. It's really important. I think, as you go through challenges and support so many different customers as their themselves, um, trying to drive change, to get to a new level of execution with new OKR and, and ROI, which ultimately is what brings them to, to purchase it to on to partner with you. That can be a challenge as I mentioned earlier.

So I think fighting that shiny and bright, uh, throughout that entire journey and keeping yourself motivated and positive and keeping them engaged is an important part of that process. Um, and at the end of the day, you know, customer success, uh, just like, I think many roles that we see, um, in our industry are.

It's are part of a broader village, um, and that capability and that impetus to ask for help and to partner cross-functionally to solve, um, to a prioritize customers, but also to solve problems on their behalf and with them, um, is a really important trait. 

[00:12:58] Rosalyn: Oh, I love that. I love that running towards the challenge and not being afraid.

Right. Just kind of being fearless. I love that. Um, you know, as you mentioned, sort of, you know, customers, right? They, they are becoming smarter. They have more expectations, you know, even us as consumers, right. We expect a certain level. Service and response rate and sort of that frictionless process, right?

Customers no longer want a vendor. Right. They really are looking for thought leadership. They're looking for a true partnership. And as you mentioned really value, right? They're looking for that value driven relationship where they're partnering with you to help them be. So what is sort of your philosophy when it comes to customer success?

I think you touched on it already a little bit, but how has that sort of help. You know, drive revenue growth from your perspective, 

[00:13:45] Rosie: we're all in customer success. At the end of the day. Um, as I mentioned earlier, we we've created products, companies, technologies, movements, really that, that are there to serve a specific user, um, to either resolve an existing pain point or to accelerate beyond where they're currently sitting from a goals perspective or a benefits perspective.

So it, it, uh, at the purist, um, Uh, you know, in, in the most simple of terms, I would say we're all in customer success. That's great. I love that. Um, and that, and that really part with the entire customer journey. If you think about marketing, you know, we build marketing websites to help customers identify and find solutions for those pain points.

We build great sales, support, success solutions, engineering teams, revenue, operations, team. To ensure that we're supporting customers to be able to easily, uh, work with us so that they can address those pain points and get value. Um, and so I've seen it time and again, in sports and software and events at the end of the day, happy customers and gave the you're engaged with your team, engaged with your product, engage with other prospects and customers and become part of your community.

Truly. Um, so they will only continue to expand their own use cases and also be your best marketers. If they're able to realize that value that comes from the understanding that ultimately they are the focus of everything that you are doing. And so it's truly the core of a strong business to think about customer success as being the number one.

Objective that we're all solving for. Um, and I, I think by championing customers and really putting them at the center of everything that you do, you're able to more quickly realize, um, you know, that product market fit and that, that, that revenue generation, I think we're all, we're all really excited about.

Um, but it really comes down to those customers. 

[00:15:37] Rosalyn: Absolutely. Um, so one of the things, um, You know, I think with last year, you know, obviously there's been a huge focus on retention, right. And the SAS business. And I think, you know, you talked about a lot about the things that, you know, we should be doing, um, around customer success and some of the things that people are obviously doing, right.

What are some of the things that you think people are do wrong when it comes to customer success and driving that value? Yeah, 

[00:16:02] Rosie: I think from, from my perspective, not putting that customer yeah. Front row and center as is obviously, I mean, I would go back to my, to my prior answer. Ultimately it's about putting that customer at the center of everything that we're doing.

And so using that as a filtering mechanism to ensure that we're focusing on the right things is, is, is a key priority when you do that. And so when, when other factors, um, get prioritized above that, that's a bit of a challenge. Um, I think the, the other thing that I would say is, especially as you're scaling a company, um, You know, sometimes we, because customer success is also the name of a function.

Um, we forget that we're all in customer success too. And so, um, I've, I've observed in other companies, is this idea that only customer success is responsible for making customers happy or driving retention, um, or, you know, driving that advocacy. And at the end of the day, Similar to us all being customer success.

Ultimately the objective of customer success is to make customer successful. Um, literally is in the name, retain them, help them to grow and help them to achieve those core objectives that they had when they first looked at your technology for pinpoint or whatever the case may be. That also spells out that we're all in retention at the end of the day.

And so I think starting with the idea that every interaction that you have from a prospect through renewal is an, is an investment in retaining that customer and making them successful and having them realize value, um, is really critical. And when you, and when you don't start with that idea and kind of think more functionally aligned, um, kind of lose.

The potential of really making that relationship incredibly valuable and incredibly meaningful for that customer. Um, and so. I would say that my advice would be to think about customer success as a core value that you're providing across the entire company. And very tied with that is this idea of retention.

And if everyone has got customer success and focus on retaining those customers, Yeah. 

[00:18:07] Rosalyn: Oh, I love that. I love that everybody's in customer success. It really is true. And everybody should be thinking about retention and driving value and put the customer really in the center. Um, so Rosie let's shift gears a little bit, right?

As a, as a woman of color myself in technology, I'm always interested in sharing success stories of other women. Right. I told you how excited I was to speak with you and kind of share your story because your story of growing up in Havana, Cuba, and then moving here to the United States, when you were, I believe 12 years old is one that I was hoping you'd be open to sharing.

[00:18:40] Rosie: Yeah. Happy to share it. I'm super proud of my heritage. Um, and in many ways, Everything that I've been able to accomplish to my family and the sacrifices that they have made for me and for my brother and the rest of our family. I, as you mentioned, I was born in Havana in Cuba. My parents, uh, really valued family and hard work and education.

And I think those are key themes that abs have were absolutely passed on to my brother. And I. Interestingly both. Uh, both of my parents had roots in farming, um, as well as small businesses. And so this, this concept of, um, really owning your own success and, and making sure that you're working as hard as you can to achieve that has been, uh, in our genetic framework from the very beginning.

I mean, I, my, well, my maternal grandmother. It's still lives on the family's farm today and, uh, in Cuba and my parents and our entire family are in touch frequently. Um, I think for us, the story really changed in, in the early nineties where my father and kind of having observed conditions in the country decided to, uh, do S take a big risk on behalf of our family and my in immigrate effectively to the United States.

Um, and that presented us with a situation right. Once he was able to achieve that. We didn't really see him for about six years. So in many ways, my brother and I were raised by my mom as a single parent, fully financially supported by my father who was here in the us. Working two to three jobs to ensure that we were happy and well taken care of in Havana.

And so while I had a very happy childhood, um, and got to invest in a lot of activities that I was interested in, including of course being an athlete and dancer. You know, it was, it was really up to my parents to manage a very difficult situation for anyone. But especially when you're doing it across, uh, countries that certainly didn't see eye to eye then.

And I'm still a bit of a challenge today. Um, but you know, I, I. That set the bar for the types of investments, uh, and the type of focus that we, my brother and I really brought to our education and to the opportunities that we were given. Once we were able to move to the U S to follow my father, um, that happened about six years later, it was December 24th.

Um, it was my first Christmas. It was, you know, so many things happen at once. Um, But I think that has remained with us is this whole concept of really investing in our family, really investing in hard work and really investing in our education so that we can take advantage of, um, what was a really big sacrifice for our entire family.

Um, and make sure that we're, we're paying that forward. Um, so you know, that, that, that's really what my heritage, um, is to me today. And, you know, I would say that the additional thing that. Has been really impactful in my life and in my career is something that I'm proud of fish to, to work on today is this whole sense of building communities and, um, and really helping across the board, we would have never been able to be successful through that move.

Um, and through that, you know, family transition without the support of our community and our family, um, Now in the U S in many ways we have chosen families, uh, where we live, um, and, uh, you know, at hop and one of the key opportunities that I'm grateful for us, the ability to, to build that, uh, for others, um, in a, in a different format.

It's really interesting. I look at my career and so much of it under is underlying, um, by these values and, and a lot of what we learned as children. Um, and you know, I'm super lucky, uh, in many ways to be where I am and to have, uh, to have parents that were willing to do anything, to make sure that we were successful.

[00:22:49] Rosalyn: Oh, that's amazing. Thank you so much for sharing that. That's just an amazing story and really talks to sort of how your values and how you got to come and where you are, right. And how what's really driven your success. Um, and family is just so important. Um, You know, aside from sort of your successful career, you mentioned education, you're obviously graduate of Harvard and you and your MBA from Stanford.

So what advice, I guess, do you have for other women, especially minority women who are really looking to elevate themselves either from an educational perspective or from a professional perspective? 

[00:23:23] Rosie: You know, I, I think from my perspective, um, impossible is nothing. Uh, I would have never predicted that I would have been able to go, uh, to either Harvard or Stanford and take advantage of those programs, but I would.

Again, super grateful and lucky to have teachers early in my high school career that believed in me and invested in me and pushed me to try no matter what I'm in to not make assumptions based on my background or, you know, the, the things that, the messages that I think we get from, from society. I think at the end of the day, there are so many incredible individuals out there that have wonderful stories, uh, that have made them.

Who they are, um, and bringing those stories and, and those experiences to institutions like Harvard and Stanford, high value, credibly valuable to everyone that's also involved there, um, because he increases our diversity of thought and increases our, um, our empathy towards others. And it really highlights the wide spectrum of the human experience.

That is so important for all of us to keep top of mind, especially. At this time where, uh, you know, it can be because of a pandemic, we are not interacting directly with each other and kind of are, are really transitioning how we all socialize, um, over the last several months. So my, my advice would be try, try again, um, and really put yourself out there.

Um, cause you're, you might find that, uh, you're exactly the fit and you're exactly that. A person that's going to make the experience. Yeah. For others that much more valuable. That's 

[00:25:08] Rosalyn: great. I love that. Yeah. Thank you. Um, so let's talk a little bit about your current role at Hoppin, right? You joined hop in when it was exploding, right?

In terms of growth last year with everyone shifting to remote virtual, a platform like hop in is really a must have. Right for organizations for both internal, but also external events, um, from a revenue, I guess, acceleration perspective. What are some of the things you think Hoppin has done really well?

And what are some of the biggest challenges that you see? 

[00:25:36] Rosie: Yeah, I mean, I'll go back to championing customers. Um, I think in many ways, We have been able to grow this, uh, this fast, because we've had, uh, the benefit and the privilege of working with incredible organizations, um, who have partnered with us from the beginning on how to improve our product and get experience and, and really, uh, truly coming to the table as stress that advisors on both sides of the house.

Um, so, you know, and, and in championing our customers, we're being able to focus on their needs, um, and really build the experiences to make them successful. I think in addition to that, one of the key things. I think hopping has done incredibly well. And I'm super grateful to be learning through this journey too, is investing in an incredible team from, um, that is actually did actually is remote first.

Um, this actually, this is something that our CEO, Johnny, um, started a new, his, his philosophy of really going after the best talent that we can find, um, and bringing them together in a setting where everyone is equally participating, um, in our conversations. And, you know, we've gone from. Uh, eight employees, I believe early last year and in February of 2022, over 500.

Oh my goodness. It's important to countries. And so it's, it's been incredible journey to, to see that and to see that entire community really coming together. Um, and so I think those two vectors have been important. Um, and what has resulted is an incredible culture, um, that is truly values driven. Um, around prioritizing impact and no ego and staying one step ahead and leading with empathy and again, championing customers.

Um, and I'll say that that's actually our biggest opportunity is how do we continue to, um, accelerate our growth support our customers build an incredible company. Remote first, um, while not sacrificing one iota of what makes our culture so powerful. Um, and I think that's for us as an executive team and for our entire company, that's a big investment.

I think a big question and a, in a conversation that we all have to ensure that it's top of mind and that we continue to invest in it as well. 

[00:27:47] Rosalyn: Wow. That is incredible growth, incredible growth. In terms of the company size, when you look back at your career to date, right, you've done so many different things, um, and really had it just an incredible journey.

So when you look back, are there, are there things that maybe you wish you knew earlier, or is there anything that you might do differently if you could do it all over? No. 

[00:28:08] Rosie: Um, and I say that knowing that, you know, there's been great, happy moments, and there's also been there have also been moments where. I needed help and I needed, um, a coach or mentor a friend, uh, to help me try to solve a problem or see the other side of a challenge.

Um, but I think each of those moments is what has made this a career and this journey that, uh, was that I'm, I don't know how else to describe it. I I've been very privileged to be on, um, a really powerful one. I would say the thing that, uh, the thing that I would recommend though, for others, which is something that I've learned, um, over, over the last several years, and again, would not change.

Um, but have now come to value a lot more is, is the idea of building community. With other leaders that can help you, um, understand the broader context of what you may be observing in your business or in your community, um, and leveraging them as, as thought partners. Um, and that to me is, is, is actually one of the reasons that I enjoy my experience at Hoppen.

Have you enjoyed my experience at Salesforce and relate IQ and the Patriots so significantly because. I, I built incredible, really built, incredible relationships with my managers, but more importantly, with other leaders in the company. Um, and that helped me to understand how they thought about it. What, what, what was the vision?

How I, as an individual contributor could help to drive. Those goals even further and what opportunities I might think about, um, to again, define that journey for myself, uh, should the timing and the, you know, the business need presents itself. Um, and so that's something that I actually see. It happened organically in many ways.

Um, but it, it, it would be an incredible opportunity for, uh, for folks out there to go and build, um, and it just sets the stage for so many interesting discussions and opportunities to learn. Um, and so I would highly recommend, uh, to think of. Yep. 

[00:30:18] Rosalyn: Yep. That's fair. That's very, very good advice. I think that too often, we think we have to accomplish everything on our own that we have to think of all the good ideas and build everything on our own versus bouncing ideas off of other people.

Right? Other people, your peers, people who've done it before. People who are learning with you because there's always, there's always best practices to share. And there's always better ways of doing things and the things that you just can't think about by yourself. So I love that. That's such great advice.

Um, so thank you so much Rosie for joining me, but as we wrap up and before I let you go, I always ask all my guests two things, one like what is the one thing about Rosie that others would be surprised to learn and to what is the one thing that you really want everyone to know about? And it could be some of the things you shared already because you're super passionate and you've been such a, you know, it's just so transparent and authentic.

Um, so it may be once something that you've already shared, but what is that sort of the one thing that other people would be surprised about? And one thing that you really wants everyone to know? 

[00:31:19] Rosie: Yeah. I would say the one thing that may be surprising. I would've loved to build a career as a dancer professionally.

Um, when I was little, I, um, I danced ballet, um, very young and absolutely loved it. Um, And then, you know, started really investing in my education over time and moved away from that. But you know, as much as I am passionate about, uh, technology and a lot of the things that we're doing to ultimately change the world, um, I would, I get lost sometimes in dancing and I still have a deep passion for it.

Uh, so that's something because you know, otherwise, like my career looks quite different from that. Um, what is one thing that I, um, that I want everyone to know about me is your second question. I, you know, I actually, in many ways, I'm, I'm very, very grateful for forums like this and the community within customer success that is so passionate about helping each other.

Um, you know, and I, uh, I'm always looking for new ways to connect with folks and, and yeah. New opportunities. And, um, I try to make sure that I'm having discussions with someone that I don't know, um, or someone, um, that I haven't met with or interacted with in the past frequently, because I think you can learn something from everyone that you've crossed paths with, um, whether it's a customer or a teammate or a partner or a vendor.

And so I'm always open to the conversation as a result of that. And I think that you can learn something new. Uh, every day. And so as a result of that, I put myself in a position where, um, I can build that in. Um, and so for example, this conversation is one of those, um, and I'm, I'm so grateful again for you hosting me here.

Um, but highly recommend that as well, too. Um, you know, to. The community that's listening to this podcast and folks that really want to explore and think about new ways of thinking new ways of doing new ways of building our society in our communities. Go try to interact with someone new and try to understand where they're coming from, learn from them.

Um, I think you'll find that, um, there's go golden nuggets in Arabic that you can bring into your life. And so it's something that I'm, you know, that's something that I'm really passionate about. Yeah. I 

love 

[00:33:48] Rosalyn: that. And I, 100% agree. I think early last year I did the same sort of like, I really wanted to get out there and just share my experience and my knowledge, but also learn from others.

So it really put myself out there and talk to people that, you know, may I may have been uncomfortable talking to in the past kind of just reaching out and say, Hey, do you wanna have a conversation? But it has brought. Brought me so much value and just so much impact on the learnings and just that community and that feel for, you know, really learning from others and building that network and that community.

So I love it. 

[00:34:18] Rosie: Yeah. It's incredibly powerful. Um, just the conversation can change the course of an idea, which is it's ultimately, uh, I mean it's incredibly inspiring. This all happened. Yeah. 

[00:34:31] Rosalyn: Well, thank you so much, Rosie for, for joining me. Completely, truly enjoyed meeting you and speaking with you. And I really appreciate you sharing your story.

[00:34:41] Rosie: Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you for pulling this together. And I'm excited to, uh, take this conversation with me, um, and learn from, uh, today as well. Thank you.

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